Cabinet approves cannabis bill

[Onion]

3 hours ago, Totemic said:

Dudes a new member and you already want to cut him up. 

I express an opinion, and your group thing it is ok to attack with guns blazing. I offer reasonable responses to the provocation and then you insult me and treat it a s a joke.  I am not going to share my thoughts in this kind of hostility. I will ask admin to delete my account. Plenty of grown ups on the planet to talk to about herb.

[Totemic]

Just now, Onion said:

I express an opinion, and your group thing it is ok to attack with guns blazing. I offer reasonable responses to the provocation and then you insult me and treat it a s a joke.  I am not going to share my thoughts in this kind of hostility. I will ask admin to delete my account. Plenty of grown ups on the planet to talk to about herb.

Suit yourself bru. I'm hardly hostile, or attacking anything except this fat blunt I just rolled.

I'm just not feeling why youd take a public forum so seriously. 

[The_StonedTrooper]

Please dont leave...

I was genuinely playing...

Hardly guns blazing 

Pew pew

Was even more meant at Evan anyway, you took it the wrong way, no need to be salty 

I was one of the first to greet you too and welcome you.

Edited August 8, 2020 by StickyD420

[The_StonedTrooper]

4 hours ago, StickyD420 said:

Someone cut an Onion, I'm crying here

See, wasn't directed at you @Onion

let's be lekker

Edited August 8, 2020 by StickyD420

[Ill_Evan]

 

[Onion]

1 hour ago, StickyD420 said:

See, wasn't directed at you @Onion

let's be lekker

I'm fine with that. I had the leaked BILL from January last year, which I have discovered was edited and is different from the actual BILL, which I have now found on the government site. My error for not looking for a new version. So I will have to retract what I said about the BILL being a bad one. I will read the revised one.
Still it is unnecessary for a bunch of people to make fun of someone for having a difference of opinion. I accept your apology though. Thanks.

[Onion]

1 hour ago, Totemic said:

Suit yourself bru. I'm hardly hostile, or attacking anything except this fat blunt I just rolled.

I'm just not feeling why youd take a public forum so seriously. 

With respect. The law is a very serious subject and that is why I take it seriously.
I have discovered subsequent to my initial comment, that the BILL I had in my possession was the leaked BILL of January last year. The 2020 BILL is revised and reads very differently, so I retract my initial criticism of the BILL.

[Ill_Evan]

9 minutes ago, Onion said:

The law is a very serious subject and that is why I take it seriously.

I felt the same, hence I may have come across harshly. 

I also apologise for the abrasiveness. It would be awesome if you stuck around and continued to contribute to the forum. 

[Totemic]

2 minutes ago, Onion said:

With respect. The law is a very serious subject and that is why I take it seriously.
I have discovered subsequent to my initial comment, that the BILL I had in my possession was the leaked BILL of January last year. The 2020 BILL is revised and reads very differently, so I retract my initial criticism of the BILL.

The law though, and this forum are not the same. You can be serious all you want. But please don't expect me to tread lightly just because of it, or feel sorry that your feelings are hurt. If you knew me at all, you'd know that I'm OCD level serious when it comes to Cannabis. That seriousness doesn't need to cloud the lighter atmosphere we try to keep going here. It is afterall a social platform.  

At best all I see is a little light humor, a mild hazing and welcome to the community, but that's just me...

[TheUltimateNoob]

Trying my gawd damn hardest man. 

Lol, and we all are grateful, honestly

Honestly you know more about the laws than anyone I've engaged with before, I aspire to have that knowledge someday.

Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

[TheUltimateNoob]

Also remember, that a "Private Dagga Club" is meant to be a non-profit organisation, so any funds accrued by the club needs to go straight back into the club for maybe like events, electricity or paying the gardener to look after the plants for the club.

I wouldn't mind starting one of these really.


Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

[The_StonedTrooper]

1 hour ago, Totemic said:

this fat blunt I just rolled.

How was it?

Strain deets and smoke?

[Totemic]

Just now, StickyD420 said:

How was it?

Strain deets and smoke?

It tasted like more....so I'm rolling another one. 

Some bubblegum sativa or kush outdoor....

[The_StonedTrooper]

Just now, Totemic said:

It tasted like more....so I'm rolling another one. 

Some bubblegum sativa or kush outdoor....

Thanks for the reply,  Kush

As for the Bill, it's better than nothing and a step toward something, but as SA we need our own unique setup and rules.

[TheUltimateNoob]

With respect. The law is a very serious subject and that is why I take it seriously.
I have discovered subsequent to my initial comment, that the BILL I had in my possession was the leaked BILL of January last year. The 2020 BILL is revised and reads very differently, so I retract my initial criticism of the BILL.

So you in the clear now man? Nothing gonna catch you off guard hopefully.
Apologies for the misunderstanding earlier.

The members here are passionate and will voice their opinion without fear from what I've seen - also, context & tone isn't generally portrayed well through text.

Hope you're all good. No hard feelings, and Happy Growing.

Sent from my POCOPHONE F1 using Tapatalk

[Onion]

36 minutes ago, Ill_Evan said:

I felt the same, hence I may have come across harshly. 

I also apologise for the abrasiveness. It would be awesome if you stuck around and continued to contribute to the forum. 

I'm in the process of cross referencing in the BILL to understand what it is saying. My concerns are the felony charges and prison sentences. They are brutal. Sure, quantities appear to be quite generous for personal use and cultivation. Another concern that I have is the definition of "remuneration". It's saying you can't exchange cannabis for money or for anything else that makes it a transaction. So I can't give you ten clones for x g dry material or concentrate for instance.
Another reason I am concerned is because our police Minister appears to be rather heavy handed in all of his dealings with the public, and shows little concern for dignity.

My earlier reference to the timing of the passing of the BILL by cabinet concerned me because of Covid. People have limited opportunities to make concerns heard. I remain skeptical of Government timing and we wait to see what Regulations are going to be introduced. Please bear in mind that I had the Draft Bill (the leaked done), not the actual Bill, and I thought it was the same thing.

[The_StonedTrooper]

Well, if you gift someone a clone, and the next day they gift you a gram...not sure...

That is harsh, and the guys in Knysna are also fighting as they got Grant's to grow, but have gotten harrassed, and all sorts.

This Country is it's own, and needs it's own style plan, not a copy and paste, of what doesn't even work for the overseas brother's. 

Let's also leave the past in the past, it's now water under the bridge

Edited August 8, 2020 by StickyD420

[Ill_Evan]

22 hours ago, TheUltimateNoob said:

Honestly you know more about the laws than anyone I've engaged with before, I aspire to have that knowledge someday.

Law degree really helps 

 

21 hours ago, Onion said:

So I can't give you ten clones for x g dry material or concentrate for instance.

Sure you can, just don't call it a transaction. You're allowed to gift 100g of dry herb, 30 seeds/seedlings, and one flowering plant. There's also a section where you can calculate amount of concentrate you can have/gift. 

It is simply two giftings happening one after the other 

21 hours ago, Onion said:

Another reason I am concerned is because our police Minister appears to be rather heavy handed in all of his dealings with the public, and shows little concern for dignity.

Don't worry. If anything gets you "in trouble" you're really only left with the inconvenience of dealing with the police as long as you are indeed within the scope of the law. 

 

21 hours ago, Onion said:

People have limited opportunities to make concerns heard. I remain skeptical of Government timing and we wait to see what Regulations are going to be introduced.

This is why we must remain vigilant and make noise if the time comes. I also have no doubt we would be given direction by Fields of Green and Schindlers Attorneys in this regard as well. 

[Onion]

@Ill_Evan I'm also concerned about the commercial aspects of the law. Any idea when those will be addressed? As I understand it, only people with licenses are allowed to cultivate under regulated circumstances. When will those license matters and regulations be addressed?

[Ill_Evan]

32 minutes ago, Onion said:

@Ill_Evan I'm also concerned about the commercial aspects of the law. Any idea when those will be addressed? As I understand it, only people with licenses are allowed to cultivate under regulated circumstances. When will those license matters and regulations be addressed?

I'm not sure it's even on the radar. There is already a legal avenue for the big guys with lots of capital to setup shop for export. So whenever we start hearing about anything to do with local commercial sales will be when that is addressed, and if it's anything like what is happening in Canada, the small guys would be left behind. So I foresee a lot of work still to be done. 

[Onion]

13 minutes ago, Ill_Evan said:

I'm not sure it's even on the radar. There is already a legal avenue for the big guys with lots of capital to setup shop for export. So whenever we start hearing about anything to do with local commercial sales will be when that is addressed, and if it's anything like what is happening in Canada, the small guys would be left behind. So I foresee a lot of work still to be done. 

It is surely unconstitutional to exclude people from climbing the ranks in commercial activity, from small-scale to corporate size enterprises. There should be a tiered licensing and multi-sector approach. It's a good example of how people across the spectrum can benefit from economic activity related to cultivation, sale and beneficiation of cannabis. It is also a good example of how easy it is for the State and Monopoly to capture the market. Anyway, that's all I can say on the subject. Lol. I will move away from such serious stuff. I didn't know that the Bill had been passed until I came onto this site as a guest.

[Fridge]

I am afraid the commercial part of regulation might become a dirty game where each big shark in the pond will try and make big money walking over dead bodies. As soon as big money is involved people can become monsters. I think people like you and me will have a tough time to establish a business unless you got friends in the right places. I agree it is unconstitutional to exclude people from getting a chance and live from the cannabis business but I have seen many things happening (especially lately during lockdown) that appear unconstitutional to me.

When it comes to Police I hope they'll get a real good briefing about what is allowed in terms of cannabis cultivation and storage and what isn't allowed. To be honest I doubt that's going to happen and we'll still see lot's of cannabis related arrests in the beginning. 

As already stated I am personally happy with the Bill in terms of what I am allowed to grow. I will never be able to consume more than 1.2 Kg (my wife doesn't smoke) in a year.

One question that I asked myself and excuse if this has been answered somewhere already. What happens if I harvest 1.5 Kg and use 0.5 Kg for bubble hash or other concentrates? In the end I should have a stash of less than 1.2 Kg again. Wouldn't that be some sort of loophole @Ill_Evan?

 

[Ill_Evan]

2 hours ago, Fridgedoor said:

One question that I asked myself and excuse if this has been answered somewhere already. What happens if I harvest 1.5 Kg and use 0.5 Kg for bubble hash or other concentrates? In the end I should have a stash of less than 1.2 Kg again. Wouldn't that be some sort of loophole @Ill_Evan?

0.25 grams of concentrate is equal to 1 gram of dried cannabis. So if you are allowed 1.2kg of dried cannabis, and you produce 1.5kg in your yield, and then take 0.5kg and turn it into concentrate, your theoretical stash amount is equal to 1kg (dried cannabis) + x of concentrate as long as the concentrate isn't more than 50g.

50g concentrate = 200g dried cannabis 

That time where you have the extra 300g over the 1.2kg limit will be like breaking the speed limit. If you wanted to play it safe I'd put that 0.5kg of dried cannabis into a container and label it "For Concentrate". 

Edit: Or if you wanted to play it even safer just gift the extra 300g dried cannabis to a mate or three and make the hash/concentrate at their place. 

Edit edit: You have to be given the opportunity to dry your harvest and measure your yield before you know how much you have so you can't be faulted for accidentally going over the limit, but do note that 1.5kg of dried cannabis is considered a trafficable amount of cannabis, so as soon as that is realised, the sooner it is rectified the better. Like with breaking the speed limit, if you notice you are speeding, and you slow down to the limit, no harm done, you're not instantly fined or arrested. 

[Onion]

It's a trafficable offence that carries a fifteen year jail sentence as I read it.

The police have been heavy handed on some people who sell cigarettes and alcohol on the black market and not on others. I would say caution is paramount.

[Totemic]

I dont think any of us think their penalties are fair. As the law currently stands I get way less jail time for trafficking a truckload.

But then I look at the bill as a whole, what its purpose is, then I see the reasoning behind its structure.

While my personal opinion is there should be no limits whatsoever.

However the limits they are suggesting are more than adequate to cover personal home use. 

The limits they are setting on gifts is more than adequate to allow us to barter freely.

As for the reasoning behind the harsh sentences. Imo if I do look at the allowances we might get...pretty much kills any serious black market activity anyway as it's just not profitable enough when people can gift 100g a go. 

We cant expect this bills scope to reach beyond the Constitutional courts ruling, which only covers personal use.