Totemic

11 hours ago, GGG said:

Plants look super healthy man

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Yeah gave them a feed too soon at 3 weeks, but they've come through. I've also been running the light closer and a bit more intense than normal to compact the nodes, since I'm not planning on topping them. Normal light height these plants would have been twice the height at 11 nodes. 

Today was a long plant day for me. Finally sure on sex, and one of the girls is actually a he... 

Transplanted to 15l. Back on a veg cycle for 2 to 3 weeks for the roots to just fill the pots a bit. I'll then be cloning them all, and flipping then. 

I've also split the girls into the different pheno groups that are emerging. Group 2 and 3 are the groups I'm mainly interested in. 

The males are all really interesting, but I've chosen one that has the most uniform node development, representing in group 2 and 3. I'm taking clones of the other males too and will keep them around a while. 

The chosen male

Group 2 and 3 females

The 4 males that are not making the cut. They are off to new homes. 

Awesome grow man. Been a treat watching them. You can be sure to see more of her in the future. I may have a release ready early next year. 

I haven't grown either of those, but do start a log when you pop those beans, so we can all follow along, and give the breeders the exposure

1 minute ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

I'm going to email them, if you dont mind or have objection. 

Wont bring you into the mix, or the issue, only feel the conversation and what details on that strain I can obtain?

Feel free to mail them... 

I just have, although my enquiry was a bit more direct to the issue. Let's see what happens. 

15 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

The word is, they are legit, and they are owned by Crop King.

There are a few actual sites that talk about them in good manner, and a few reddit comments about them, all show they are a company and they have sold seeds, and there are some good reports on the grows too.

This still doesn't excuse or explain

Makes it even more unbelievable that my cross is actually listed there. I consider myself approachable and would gladly ship my seeds to anywhere in there world if the world wants them. Why as Crop King risk your reputation by listing a cross that is just barely available from a single breeder. It's not a common cross, and is the only chocolate Gelato listed on seed finder. Sure there will definitely be chocolate Gelatos stemming off the cookies lines coming from the US, but none with Chocolope NL in the lineage

3 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Well, well, if that Canadian Site, didnt impress the hell out of me with their extremely detailed description of @Totemicseeds, and I was already convinced by that, that I wanted to try his seeds, this 100% rate, has me convinced without doubt. 

In seriousseriousness, I am sad I have so many runs to get through, before I can even think of buying more seed stock, but when I am ready, I'll be investing in the high quality, good moral principles, and exceptional business practices that Totemic has, is and stands for.

Good show brother man

Man they know stuff about my cross I don't even know yet

8 minutes ago, 420SA said:

Either it's a crazy coincidence (which I highly doubt), or this "breeder" most likely came across you on Instagram and found inspiration for the shitty random bulk seeds they bought and are now reselling.

They honestly could be labelling random genetics as chocolate gelato. The similarities are far too obvious... you describe the line as "carrying a sweet, fruity aroma on a subtle spiciness" and they describe it as "Sweet, Fruity, Spicy". The lineage listed is of course exactly the same as well.

They look to be new on the scene, judging by their google reviews (probably fake), but are establishing themselves quite quickly by the looks of it. I get your vibe of wanting to let these guys do what they do but you don't want it to get to a point where people are wondering whether you are the counterfeiter. Maybe setting the record straight in a IG post, which you can refer people back to, might help to just make sure you get ahead of the shitstorm that may brew. Just a thought

Ja, but I just hate the drama... And insta just overflows with it...

My long term goals for my lines are not just to get into home grows... 

From next spring totemic is filling a few fields, and a few greenhouses. The brand is here to serve the local market, and an international (probably dropshipping) pop-up seedbank isn't going to damage that

Yeah that's what's great about the advancements of the industry. Phylos.bio is so appealing to me, and would love it if a South African company would dive into this at an affordable price. 

However there are other alternatives available that cover the terpenes and cannabinoids quite well like Qure, and a few other labs. Still pricey though... 

3 minutes ago, Ill_Evan said:

This interests me, but I am not sure how they went about this. Did they just buy a shitton of your seeds and resell as their own or did they just make a botched cross and called it Chocolate Gelato? Or is it not even the right crosses and they just selling some random strain as Chocolate Gelato?

Educate me bro. 

That's my point... Who knows what they selling... They sure didn't get the seeds from me. 

Chocolope NL was released for the first Growoff at F4. Yeah I gave out quite a few to everybody, but it was never commercially available except a few fems, and will only be available for the first time commercially on the F5 generation I'm working on. 

Chocolate Gelato... Man she's brand brand new..I never released F1s only released her Nov last year on F2. 

So ja... Who knows what they selling

2 minutes ago, CG420za said:

I just saw this now and went on the site... @Totemicat the rate you're pushing out crosses, i will need to change my grow style to even smaller plants so i can try all the flavours. Can't wait for spring!

Yeah just a few pre release available. The last of any feminized work for the next year or so...

I have many older lines that need reviving and my focus is on my Tortoni and my Chocolope NL line for the rest of the year

Look, anyone can take the same genetic lineage and recreate my strains... But it won't be my selections and choices I made through the years... 

I'm also fully aware that once I've released something it isn't just mine anymore... 

I wish them well... If you building a business on lies it ain't going to last

It was just a matter of time before it started happening, although I really thought it would be someone local first. 

Browsing around Google this morning having a look at how my pages and products are propagating, I noticed my Chocolate Gelato listed at the following seedbank

https://www.sunwestgenetics.com/chocolate-gelato-feminized/

It's odd since my seeds are not available internationally, and I never released my chocolate Gelato line until November last year on F2s, and fems in January, and only a really small amount was/is available. 

I'll give it to the site though... They sure do know how to spin bullshit on a strain. I'll copy the first piece and use it though, as I'm really bad with doing proper strain writeups. 

Many have questioned why I have gone the route I have with my packaging...This is the reason. 

If you are looking for any of my seeds, they are only available through the totemic website, and the listed distributors on the site. 

So the first 5 males have been removed, and the 4 unknowns are girls, so 14 girls. 

If they are under a 240 QB from Light it up, then you should have your lights dimmed to 160-180, at a height of 70-80cm for this early veg stage

30 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

what hahahah so I was wrong about being wrong,

the F4s generally have more stability across the board. crazyness... 

I would assume this is only the case when you been doing everything on point since the beginning. 

have seen some questionable breeding projects go down hahah never had the pleasure of following a project along that got so far as to make f4s

will be very exciting to see how they turn out!! 

That's why I'm documenting my grows as best I can. You can be sure I'll be posting up logs for each generation I work on. Taking a new cross and turning it into a strain. 

6 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

I see, I have also noticed that stress can push them to show preflowers. a batch of clones all from the same plant, 2 started stressing pushed pistils during 18.6.

some guys wait about a month, then just switch to 12.12 just to get the sex and then take things from there.

so ultimately, you are stabilising, but still have to complete a few runs?

according to your way of look and feel would you concider them stable at F4 because of the line you're working with or does this stay the same across the board? and do you first do a run to see how many different traits pop up or how would you determine pheno stability? 

The difference visually when comparing an F3 population to the next f4 population is astounding. F4 you hit a stable output for whatever you were selecting. 

F4 is a sweet spot. F2 and F3 are still unstable. From F5 you start trading vigor for stability. 

9 hours ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

I have seen my plants show sex on 18.6 before but haven't noticed it that early, might just have to train my eye a bit

I understand you say the F2 is where the real hunt begin, but coming from the F1 that is already stable to an extent would they not already be a bit more stable? Are the F2s being bred to isolate traits of the current Tortonis or because you're looking for different traits?

I see I see, I guess part of the growers responsibility is also plant health and obviously, or more like hopefully every true breeder will only care to work with healthy plants that are not making their days harder.

before I got on the forum and really started growing I remember hearing a lot about this Chocolope strain, everyone was growing it and this was about 2-3 years back. so I know you been working with it for a while. then I joined the forum when, lo and behold, the mastermind behind it all. I feel honored!

Some plants just don't really push the primordial flowers, but I've found that expressing the sex has little to do with time passed, and more to do with how far the plant development is. 

Most F1 generations are really homozygous, especially when the parents are genetically far apart. It creates a true F1 hybrid. Using similar or closely related parent plants don't necessarily create a new hybrid expression, but just express similar to that line(like all the lines with GSC lines... They are all the same....

The F2 recombination event is an interesting one, and many previously recessive traits become dominant, previously dominant traits either recess or lock in. The F2 generation is never a stable generation, and this is especially true due to the polyhybrid that this line is. 

There are many directions one can take a line. I'm not looking for different traits, but looking to isolate the current F1 traits and lock them in to a stable F4. 

Healthy cannabis plants are actually quite resilient against pest and disease as they are aromatic plants with volatile terpenes and cannabinoids. It becomes an issue with plants in isolation to other plants. Pests don't have a choice so they go for the cannabis. In an ecosystem the pests would way rather eat something else. 

As for environmental diseases like PM etc, epigenetics play a role and generation after generation rewrites their DNA based on the environment they experience as an evolutionary step. 

10 minutes ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

I see these 2 eyeing each other out, and should get a room

That one bottom right pheno I actually an outlier... Different leaf shape, smell, structure is all off so it's going to be interesting. 

So far, it's actually the back 4 males and back 4 females that are expressing the phenotype I'm interested in. 

5 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

did they start sexing after a month on 18/6 then or do you only start counting now?

another question I have on this topic is, when pheno hunting to stabilise a genetic when does one bring in stressing factors to see how well who does and fights for itself against pests and diseases? do you use a refractometer or just go by looks and your personal feel? 

Yeah preflowers are easily distinguishable as male or female at 31 days from seed. 

This is a seed run to get me to the F2s, where the real pheno hunting begins. This is a stable F1 generation, but the F2 generation may or may not present with unfavorable traits. 

Selecting for pest resistance is actually quite low on my selection list. 

My selection is intuitive, involves look, feel, smell, growth patterns.

This male selection on this run will be my 6th consecutive selection on the chocolope NL lineage. I've learnt what my males with that lineage generally pass on to females. Males add a lot more than people generally think. 

Nice 50/50 split, showing sex at a month old. Day 1 of 12/12. 

11 hours ago, highchome said:

Hi @Totemic,

I recently got your 2021 Summer pack from the 420sa store, with these strains

• Chocolate Gelato
• Palomino 
• Tortoni 
• Cherry Gelato CBD

 

Do you have a rough idea of what you'd expect effect wise from each of those? 

Thanks

 

Effect wise, Chocolate Gelato, while a whole lot more indica than most Gelato strains, still has a clear, uplifting high, with minimal body stone. 

Palomino is very indica dominant and more an evening type smoke, with a relaxing high, and a medicated body effect. 

Tortoni is also indica dominant, with an uplifting, creative high, with virtually no body stone

Gelato CBD effects are going to vary, but it's an interesting mild high/not quite high. Really just calming and anxiety reducing. 

1 minute ago, The_StonedTrooper said:

Sick space brother, wow

Got a bunker vibe to it. 

2 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

psilocybin causes high neurogenesis (forming of new brain cells and nerve pathways in the brain)

YOU CAN LITERALLY REWIRE YOUR BRAIN WITH MUSHROOMS

doesn't matter who you are, how smart you are, how much discipline you portray or how little you believe it will work on you, 

IT WORKS.

medicine? 

mushrooms

Another part of my journey over the last decade. Psilocybin allowed me a connection to myself that I needed to move forward. 

Nature is medicine 

36 minutes ago, GGG said:

They look lekker man , amped to see how they turn out

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Not going to be much of a show since it's a seed run. At least half or maybe more could show male in a week or 2, and a lot of plants are going to be culled.