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Chocolate Gelato F2 -> F3


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4 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

whooooooooo !!!!

:-flyinghi

not wasting any time hahah looking good man, you got any twins in previous runs too or the just spontaneously coming out as twins now? do I see some mutant there aswell? 

Yeah twins are common, and have come up in the F1s too. There is whorled phylotaxy among them. They have already fallen out of the race, while only the stronger of the twins will remain. 

I have a few related regular lines I'm working on all at once, advancing to the next generation. There is so little time in a year to fit in cycles that I don't have any to waste 😅

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28 minutes ago, Totemic said:

Yeah twins are common, and have come up in the F1s too. There is whorled phylotaxy among them. They have already fallen out of the race, while only the stronger of the twins will remain. 

I have a few related regular lines I'm working on all at once, advancing to the next generation. There is so little time in a year to fit in cycles that I don't have any to waste 😅

when you cull the weaker of the twin you just cut it at the base? say the stronger twin is the selected one in the end, would breeding with that one not still carry the twin gene? I would think to get rid of that trait completely you would have to get tid of both of the twins, or is the trait not that big of a concern?

oh yes, something we will never have enough of is time, and sadly it waits for no one! 😁

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Posted (edited)

It's not a matter of a twin gene. It has to do with the physiology of the calyx, having two pistils a calyx, and an ovule per pistil. 

In a natural pollination environment the pollen is diluted in the air, and generally only one of the pistils might catch pollen. Once a calyx is pollinated at one pistil the other dies as the seed starts to develop. 

When you look at the extreme density of having a whole male plant in a 1m2 space, then twin come up often as practically every pistil is pollinated at once. 

Twins are rarely identical, and are in fact separate genetic expressions. 

Edited by Totemic
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I see, so the two pistils and two seperate ovules and each get fertilised lead to one seed forming with two plants in it? not one calyx with two seeds in? 

I've seen quite a few situations where one calyx has two seeds in it, poorly formed seeds, but what would be the situation here? 

might be a stupid question, but this is how we learn hahah

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Yeah, the two ovules are formed when the female strips her chromosomes in 2. Each representing one side of the 'x'. 

When both pistils are fertilized within that time period before what must be a chemical trigger to switch to seed development and each pollen grain reaches both ovules, they both develop and mostly share a single husk. Sometimes they don't, and just looking at the seed you can see its 2 seeds that are almost fused. 

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7 minutes ago, Totemic said:

Yeah, the two ovules are formed when the female strips her chromosomes in 2. Each representing one side of the 'x'. 

When both pistils are fertilized within that time period before what must be a chemical trigger to switch to seed development and each pollen grain reaches both ovules, they both develop and mostly share a single husk. Sometimes they don't, and just looking at the seed you can see its 2 seeds that are almost fused. 

yes that's it, looks like it should've been one seed that's just split. in that case most time neither seed is good, but with the case of them sharing a husk there will be one that had a better chance of developing and one that's a little less developed. with there being no chance of the already formed x chromosome splitting in two as with some other reproductive processes, with regards to a cannabis plant twins are not a genetic mutation, but rather a casual physiological phenomenon. 

Ok, cool got a better understanding now, thank you sir! 

Still haven't pulled the trigger on plant breeding, got tons to learn still as you can see! 😅

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Naughty.Psychonaut said:

yes that's it, looks like it should've been one seed that's just split. in that case most time neither seed is good, but with the case of them sharing a husk there will be one that had a better chance of developing and one that's a little less developed. with there being no chance of the already formed x chromosome splitting in two as with some other reproductive processes, with regards to a cannabis plant twins are not a genetic mutation, but rather a casual physiological phenomenon. 

Ok, cool got a better understanding now, thank you sir! 

Still haven't pulled the trigger on plant breeding, got tons to learn still as you can see! 😅

Yeah I'm not saying genetic twins aren't possible. Any damage could occur to an ovule that could cause weird stress response growth. I also can't explain what that tidal wave that happens does when the pollen and ovule merge and create the embryo. 

At best I'm describing things and processes in a way I understand them, as we can't see what's actually happening on that microscopic level moment to moment. 

 

Edited by Totemic
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4 minutes ago, Totemic said:

Yeah I'm not saying genetic twins aren't possible. Any damage could occur to an ovule that could cause weird stress response growth. I also can't explain what that tidal wave that happens does when the pollen and ovule merge and create the embryo. 

At best I'm describing things and processes in a way I understand them, as we can't see what's actually happening on that microscopic level moment to moment. 

 

understandable, and I appreciate you saying that, the only real advice we can give is that based on our own experience.

when giving advice based on what others listed as "fact" we would just be discussing "hearsay". this is why I don't like when people try to convince me of things they read somewhere once, which sadly happens a lot in the community. 

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